‘A delight from start to finish’

Gerard Davis [GD]: I understand that, musically speaking, this is quite an unusual project.  

Ilya Demutsky [ID]: It is. Salle de danse was originally created by Paul [Lightfoot] for film during the Covid pandemic and it used Knudåge Riisager’s orchestrations for Harald Lander’s famous ballet Études. When it was decided it was going to be adapted for stage, it was agreed that a new score was required and in spring 2024, Paul rang me and asked if I’d like to do it. To be honest, at first I was slightly intimidated because it meant composing for some choreography that had already been almost entirely created on another piece of music!  

Matthew Rowe [MR]: I have to say that making a composition to fit existing choreography is incredibly difficult and the reverse of the usual process. Ilya’s been remarkably skilful in creating a work that’s full of variety yet, at the same time, totally coherent.  

ID: In some ways it resembled working with animation: I watched the video of the choreography and then mapped out the musical phrasing, structure, mood and rhythm. The first sections were really difficult and I started to panic a bit but, gradually, I found an approach that worked and the process became more natural. Inevitably, the new music required adjustments on the choreographic side as well so Paul, Sol [León] and I expanded the ballet, added new sections and, in many ways, rethought it while keeping the central idea intact.  

GD: How would you describe the music?  

ID: Since this is a ballet about ballet and it grew out of Études, which is based on the daily technical exercises of classical dancers, I think of my score as a kind of ‘alphabet’ of ballet music. I deliberately used a traditional sound world: a large Romantic orchestra, clear melodic writing and bright, often virtuosic orchestration. In that sense, it’s pure ballet music. At the same time, however, there’s an underlying sense of the present moment because we’re speaking about something timeless.  

MR: Almost all the movements have classical ballet titles, such as Pas de Deux, Romantique, Port de Bras and Mazurka, but Ilya has given them a wonderful makeover in terms of harmony, orchestration and phrase structure. Each musical number has their own distinct character, colour and mood – it’s so playful and joyful. 

GD Ilya, what’s it like when you hear a live orchestra play a piece of yours for the first time?  

ID: It’s always a very intense experience. Sol and Paul, as far as I understand, don’t often commission new music and usually work with pre-existing scores. In that sense, creating a completely new piece required them to put a huge level of trust  

in me – music develops slowly and unpredictably and the result can differ from initial expectations. Of course, today it’s possible to make synthetic demos which give an approximate idea of the score but music only truly begins to exist when it’s performed live. Fortunately, in this case, we had the opportunity to make an orchestral recording in advance and that was where the real transformation happened.  

MR: The first time I read the score, I thought, is it just me or are we all going to have fun with this? On the first day of the recording sessions everyone read it and just started smiling. 

ID: When it’s played by an orchestra for the first time, that’s the moment when the music’s no longer abstract – it becomes a physical reality in space and you begin to hear it differently, more objectively, almost from the outside. It’s a crucial stage because it reveals immediately if everything works: balance, form, timbre and internal logic. And there’s always an element of surprise when what you’ve written begins to exist independently.  

GD: In what ways will the working relationship between the two of you help ensure the success of the performance?  

ID: Actually, what’s important to me is that the choreographer feels comfortable with the conductor and that they’re flexible and experienced. All of that came together in the name of Matthew Rowe, whom Sol and Paul proposed.  

MR: I’ve worked a lot with Sol and Paul from my time in the Netherlands, particularly during their long stint at Nederlands Dans Theater, but this is the first production I’ve worked on with Ilya. It’s interesting because, when I read a new score I always start by asking myself lots of questions. Why’s this part like this? Why’s it not like that? There are inevitably queries, and sometimes small mistakes or misprints, so one of the great things about working with a living composer is that you can ask them directly if what you see in the score is actually correct or not.  

ID: Matthew is unique. I remember on our first call together, we spent nearly three hours going through the score in detail. So, by the time of the first orchestral rehearsal, we were more than prepared. Once the material’s refined and balanced like that, then the interpretation, working with the orchestra and coordinating with the choreography all become the conductor’s domain.  

GD: So, what are the challenges for the conductor in this score?  

MR: Tempi, tempi, tempi! The complexity of Sol and Paul’s choreography requires precise tempi and the score has more than 20 movements. The longest is five minutes and the shortest is one, so capturing their spirit and character can be tricky, especially as there are deliberately quirky things in there too. Ilya wrote the music in close collaboration with Sol and Paul so it’s completely integrated with their vision for the ballet and, as a result, Ilya has a particularly clear sense of how the music should connect to the movements of the dancers. That’s been extremely beneficial to me.  

GD: Ilya, you’ve composed for ballet before. When you see the dancers perform to your score, do they reveal new perspectives in the music?  

ID: Even though I’ve written nine ballets, choreography remains, in many ways, an incomprehensible language to me. So, every time I see my music come to life on stage through dancers, it still feels like a kind of miracle. Music that exists on paper – and even in orchestral sound – acquires an entirely new dimension when it’s combined with movement. Meanings emerge that could never have been anticipated during the compositional process.  

MR: That’s true of anything you do with dancers and it’s one of the reasons I really love working with them. Suddenly, it becomes a new collaboration; another dialogue starts because of the things they find in the music. They bring such energy and electricity to everything they do.  

GD: What’s the best thing about composing for ballet?  

ID: When the music merges with movement, space, light and scenography, an entirely different quality of perception emerges and that’s when it stops being just music and becomes part of a living theatrical organism. For me, that’s the essence of working in ballet – it’s not about creating an autonomous piece, but contributing to a unified artistic statement.  

GD: And the most challenging?  

ID: Because there are no words in ballet, everything must be expressed through music and movement. At the same time, however, the music can’t be simplistic or merely illustrative – it must retain an internal logic and depth. Also, it needs to be functional and, by that, I mean it needs to be memorable, clear for performers and workable in rehearsal. Finding that balance between complexity and clarity is the most difficult task.  

MR: And I think Ilya’s achieved that balance here. It’s a brilliant piece of music, really clever. Sometimes it can take a long time for a score to really get inside you but this piece went in very quickly. In some ways, it reminds me a little of Prokofiev; it has very colourful melodies, ingenious counterpoint and some wonderful orchestration with lots of little, slightly off-kilter notes. It’s a delight from start to finish.  

– Gerard Davis is a London-based dance writer who regularly contributes to Dance Europe.